Major failure by CBS! When you KNOW Trump and Vance are liars, then chose to allow either of them carte blanch in front of cameras, that’s a professional failure of major magnitude! Boo CBS!
Rather than a dollar bill he could use poker chips or coins, the sound of them dropping into the cookie jar would be much better than just paper rustling.
Of course it’s a prop. So what will they do, fact check it? And if one of them walked out from behind the podium, will they send him to sit in the corner? The GOP keeps breaking the rules and doesn’t get punished for it. Isn’t not lying a very basic rule that doesn’t even need to be stated.
That is how I think he should handle it, "That's a lie," and move on. Vance (Trump) supporters don't seem to care that they lie all the time, but Independents and moderate Republicans might note how many times Walz calls out the lies. They will either confirm details for themselves or not. Walz should call it out and move on every time.
He should say, "It's a shame we don't have fact checkers for this debate, because that was a lie;" or "Is that the 2024 JD Vance answer? Because the 2020 JD Vance answer was the exact opposite;" or if Vance brings up immigrants taking American jobs, Walz needs to ask, "JD, what American jobs did your in-laws take away from Americans when they came here to make a better life for themselves?."
I disagree. The ABC News moderators did a good job of fact-checking some comments during the Harris/Trump debate. They obviously couldn't fact-check everything, so they did their best to cherry-pick. They are professionals. They know how to do this.
If the program stops on the first question. It will be evidence that the Felon 45/Vance team is not ready for prime time, much less represent the country. However, I think the " that is a lie" should work-move on
That's exactly what I thought. Remember, Vance may not be as much of a delicate flower as Trump, but saying something like that will put him on the defensive.
That is a core issue with so-called “debate” formats. Then the host network passes the responsibility to the liar’s opponent. As Steady points out, it means that debater faces a choice of factchecking the fire hose of lies or using his/her time to present their points.
I’ve come to detest even calling them debates. The most ‘memorable’ moments lauded by the media from over the years are nothing more than meaningless clever quips. It is also why Donnie refuses so many interviews. He refused NPR for 6 years and then walked out. He walked out on Barbara Walters, 60 Minutes and others. More recently he delayed the start of his NABJ appearance because there would be factchecking. Failing to browbeat them into submission, he had a shorter appearance & lied about the delay.
That's true because they would have to use the whole segment to find out why Waltz said he carried guns in a combat zone and was thousands of miles from ANY combat zone. And why he lied for years about his rank in the military. But he's a liberal so lying is allowed, correct?
Thanks for underscoring the false equivalence argument, Jack. If Gov. Walz answered a direct question with a lie, his opponent could call him out.
BTW, the first thing you cited was a harmless embellishment; the second was a technicality. Neither was consequential. His opponent says fabrication is okay if it helps to highlight a supposed issue ("the ends. justify the means" crap).
You may be correct. However, letting Vance know it’s FANTASY LAND NIGHT is a poor choice. He’s a weasel cut from the same sociopathic cloth as DJT. They just “weave” their narrative into whatever dark image of reality suits their agenda. Sad.
Vance has a lot of debate practice especially against a folksy opponent such as Walz who is similar to the Democratic candidate he faced in his Senate race. Walz has almost no debate experience and he may have to be on defense against Vance’s lies. Walz must hit Vance hard on his position on the Heritage 2025 plan, reproductive rights, and Vance’s 2020 critique of Trump. As Karl Rove said of the Harris-Trump debate, games/debates are won on offense. Let’s hope that Mayor Pete has prepared Tim well because he is definitely the underdog in this forum.
I think you may be right. He may even be able to bait Vance like Harris did with Trump. If Vance is as narcissistic as Trump, which I think he may be, he won't be able to resist taking the bait. Protecting his image will always be priority number one.
I beg to differ: Tim Ryan, Vance's opponent in the 2022 Ohio Senate race is not "folksy." He was a multi-term US congressman. The Democratic party didn't spend a dime in Ryan's race. And Vance was bankrolled by a billionaire, Peter Thiel.
Not sure I see Gov Walz as the underdog. For one thing, he has truth on his side; for another, Walz is quite witty! "See what I did there?" I think honesty is the advantage!
ABC did an excellent job with fact checking. Of course, trump & Company complained. This is a cowardly, unprofessional move on the part of CBS. The network, as Dan says, doesn't want the negative feedback. But the Party Of Liars needs calling out because CBS's viewers, the democratic process, deserve the truth. What happened to verifying sources,etc. ? This country, with media help, is going down a Rabbit Hole of "Alternate Facts." That's a Black Hole wherein truth will ultimately disappear. Tragic times and shame on CBS.
It's disturbing on so many levels that the mainstream media kowtows to the #BLOTUS. TRump is the Biggest Liar of the United States and continually goes unchallenged by the press. It's infuriating.
Reposing and earlier comment of mine because I think it's appropriate here:
This is how Trump does it. This is how he gets so many enablers around him. Just give Trump what he wants and then we won't get in trouble. Just give Trump what he wants and then we can use his popularity to win the White House. The only trouble is that Trump, like an addiction, will just keep wanting more and more. There's no end to it. If you can imagine you can ever appease and control this man you're seriously fooling yourself. Guys like Trump don't know the meaning of the word "satisfied". There will never be a time when this pays off, he's gotten what he wants, and now we can go about the business of taking care of our own needs. And the deeper we go in the more painful it is to get out. So better to take the stand NOW.
Hold him accountable like we would any adult. Let him bitch, moan, point fingers and threaten. Unless we want to continue being bullied we have to stand up to the bully.
Yes that’s what he does. And when he doesn’t get his own way on his terms with the media he refuses interviews, walks out & in all cases lies. Regardless the media gets heat for not doing their job. He’s trained them and his minions well. But he’s had 40+ years of practice.
There's obviously been a change in policies at CBS, and not for the better. Why should the Republican candidate get a pass? It's spineless and not upholding good journalistic practice.
It’s poor journalism for CBS to provide fact-checking to its viewers but not rebut the candidates.. The candidates’ lies need to be confronted by the unbiased source — the moderators.
Absolutely! It's not Tim Walz's job to "police" Vance (who is a tRump clone in terms of character & lying). But I have a feeling Gov. Walz will easily outshine Vance regardless.
The Press has its 1st Amendment freedom because it is not supposed to be afraid of telling the truth - or presenting information that has been verified and ooh, fact checked. That's not being responsible. That's cowardice.
Yes, we absolutely need moderators to fact check. It's not bias when misinformation is called out. It was really important that ABC called out the "eating cats and dogs" falsehood that Trump dropped and then doubled down on.
I'd also like to add that we need them to ask a question again to both candidates if either candidate dodges a question.
Agree completely, Anne. I stopped watching the TMURP/Harris debate after a half hour because orange man was spewing lies as fast as he could talk, and neither candidate was directly answering any of the questions. Frustrating.
You can tell CBS how angry/disgusted/appalled/outraged or whatever you are about the refusal to fact check. Here's the link: https://www.cbs.com/showfeedback/success/
Is it fear of MAGA blowback or fear of CBS investors losing their tax cut Trump promises? Cowardice and greed do not make for a credible news network. Dan Rather is right, unfortunately.
Done! I chose CBS News Special for the category. Cowardly that they didn't list the debate as a choice. I miss the days when the news had strict lines for being non-biased and professional. I remember being taught about yellow journalism in high school. It seems like that is all we have now.
That's the page on which I wrote my comment to CBS this afternoon (which I shared here a moment ago), even though there was no choice for Debate or for Special Events.
I wrote my feelings to CBS .....and also shared this link with others I knew would do so as well. Thanks Laurie for posting the link!!!! The selections I chose were 'Primetime' and 'CBS News Special'
I just wrote a fairly long comment, but I’m not sure that it went through. It kept saying when I hit “submit” that I needed to write alphanumeric feedback — which of course I was. Then, I accidentally hit something and lost that screen. When I got back to the screen, my message had disappeared, but I did get a message a moment later on that screen saying “Thank you for your feedback. We will make sure that it gets to the right department” or something along those lines.
I wrote this to CBS News on their website this afternoon:
"I am disgusted that a company with your illustrious history of newscasting has decided not to fact check the Walz/Vance debate, knowing without a doubt (because Vance himself admits it) that Vance is a liar. You will do a huge disservice to the viewers by not confronting and refuting the lies and pretending this election is a horse race when it will decide whether we remain a democracy or fall into an autocracy led by a mentally ill, aging man whose running mate is as vicious as he is. You should confront Vance with the horrific implications of Project 2025. You should honor the legacy of Walter Cronkite, Dan Rather and other of your renowned journalists of the past and reconsider your decision to not fact check.
I chose Face the Nation because there was no option for the debate. I hope whoever reads this passes my comment on to the responsible parties."
The only blow back ABC received was from Trump. I'm proud that they took control of the narrative and called a lie a lie. It's all about the bottom line and ratings. Thank you for keeping us steady.
I immediately thought of Dan Rather when I saw the update yesterday about CBS "declining" (refusing?) to fact check the debate in real time and on-air. I'm so glad to see this column! 💪
Major failure by CBS! When you KNOW Trump and Vance are liars, then chose to allow either of them carte blanch in front of cameras, that’s a professional failure of major magnitude! Boo CBS!
In fairness, CBS may have realized that if they did fact-checking in this debate, they might not get past the first question.
I hope Gov. Walz doesn't get wrapped up in fact-checking and miss the opportunity to shine. Perhaps he could just say, "That's a lie," and move on.
“That’s a lie” is so much better than the mealy mouthed “fact checking.”
I think Walz should have a cookie jar and each time JD lies he should put a dollar in it.
He can be raising money for the people hurt by the GOP lies. Maybe to get a ticket for someone who needs to travel for an abortion.
It can be the lie-a-thon.
Rather than a dollar bill he could use poker chips or coins, the sound of them dropping into the cookie jar would be much better than just paper rustling.
Love it
A good idea, but the jar and a fistful of dollar bills would be ruled as a prop.
Of course it’s a prop. So what will they do, fact check it? And if one of them walked out from behind the podium, will they send him to sit in the corner? The GOP keeps breaking the rules and doesn’t get punished for it. Isn’t not lying a very basic rule that doesn’t even need to be stated.
I wonder if it's just an expected phenomena these days. Sad.
Props are not allowed per the debate rules.
Love love love!
Maybe he could use the money to help hurricane-ravaged people.
Love it!!!💙💙💙
Good idea for Gov Walz to say "That's a lie" and move on to his own agenda. I hope he will do so.
Then so be it. Better than hours of unchecked lies, spiteful mean racist sexist and thuggy lies.
That is how I think he should handle it, "That's a lie," and move on. Vance (Trump) supporters don't seem to care that they lie all the time, but Independents and moderate Republicans might note how many times Walz calls out the lies. They will either confirm details for themselves or not. Walz should call it out and move on every time.
He should say, "It's a shame we don't have fact checkers for this debate, because that was a lie;" or "Is that the 2024 JD Vance answer? Because the 2020 JD Vance answer was the exact opposite;" or if Vance brings up immigrants taking American jobs, Walz needs to ask, "JD, what American jobs did your in-laws take away from Americans when they came here to make a better life for themselves?."
Fabulous!! Thank you, Brenda!!
I disagree. The ABC News moderators did a good job of fact-checking some comments during the Harris/Trump debate. They obviously couldn't fact-check everything, so they did their best to cherry-pick. They are professionals. They know how to do this.
If the program stops on the first question. It will be evidence that the Felon 45/Vance team is not ready for prime time, much less represent the country. However, I think the " that is a lie" should work-move on
That's exactly what I thought. Remember, Vance may not be as much of a delicate flower as Trump, but saying something like that will put him on the defensive.
My thoughts exactly. 💙💙💙💙💙
I agree with you Bob.
Great suggestion! Maybe add . . ."and you know it!" 😊
That is a core issue with so-called “debate” formats. Then the host network passes the responsibility to the liar’s opponent. As Steady points out, it means that debater faces a choice of factchecking the fire hose of lies or using his/her time to present their points.
I’ve come to detest even calling them debates. The most ‘memorable’ moments lauded by the media from over the years are nothing more than meaningless clever quips. It is also why Donnie refuses so many interviews. He refused NPR for 6 years and then walked out. He walked out on Barbara Walters, 60 Minutes and others. More recently he delayed the start of his NABJ appearance because there would be factchecking. Failing to browbeat them into submission, he had a shorter appearance & lied about the delay.
https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4808075-nabj-trump-interview-fact-check-kamala-harris/
Yes!
That's true because they would have to use the whole segment to find out why Waltz said he carried guns in a combat zone and was thousands of miles from ANY combat zone. And why he lied for years about his rank in the military. But he's a liberal so lying is allowed, correct?
Thanks for underscoring the false equivalence argument, Jack. If Gov. Walz answered a direct question with a lie, his opponent could call him out.
BTW, the first thing you cited was a harmless embellishment; the second was a technicality. Neither was consequential. His opponent says fabrication is okay if it helps to highlight a supposed issue ("the ends. justify the means" crap).
Anyone old enough to remember the Gong Show? I vote for a gong and move on to the next question.
Perfect!👍
That works.
This! 👆
Love it!!
YES!!!! Gov. Walz could have one of those 10" Asian style gong with a wooden mallet!! LOVE IT!!
You may be correct. However, letting Vance know it’s FANTASY LAND NIGHT is a poor choice. He’s a weasel cut from the same sociopathic cloth as DJT. They just “weave” their narrative into whatever dark image of reality suits their agenda. Sad.
Vance has a lot of debate practice especially against a folksy opponent such as Walz who is similar to the Democratic candidate he faced in his Senate race. Walz has almost no debate experience and he may have to be on defense against Vance’s lies. Walz must hit Vance hard on his position on the Heritage 2025 plan, reproductive rights, and Vance’s 2020 critique of Trump. As Karl Rove said of the Harris-Trump debate, games/debates are won on offense. Let’s hope that Mayor Pete has prepared Tim well because he is definitely the underdog in this forum.
I have absolutely no doubt that Governor Tim Walz will hold his own against Shady Vance. No doubts, whatsoever.
With Mayor Pete as a coach I'm sure he'll do fine.
I think you may be right. He may even be able to bait Vance like Harris did with Trump. If Vance is as narcissistic as Trump, which I think he may be, he won't be able to resist taking the bait. Protecting his image will always be priority number one.
I beg to differ: Tim Ryan, Vance's opponent in the 2022 Ohio Senate race is not "folksy." He was a multi-term US congressman. The Democratic party didn't spend a dime in Ryan's race. And Vance was bankrolled by a billionaire, Peter Thiel.
He is still paid by Thiel! He is his employer but I wonder what his real job is. He has never stated that.
Plus which, Ryan ran a world-class loser of a campaign. Really poorly strategized.
Not sure I see Gov Walz as the underdog. For one thing, he has truth on his side; for another, Walz is quite witty! "See what I did there?" I think honesty is the advantage!
I vote with you! That’s a great idea and it’s very funny! Thanks!
Journalistic malpractice!
Once again the media capitulates to Trump.
Infuriating! And very spineless of CBS to abdicate one of the most serious responsibilities of good journalism.
ABC did an excellent job with fact checking. Of course, trump & Company complained. This is a cowardly, unprofessional move on the part of CBS. The network, as Dan says, doesn't want the negative feedback. But the Party Of Liars needs calling out because CBS's viewers, the democratic process, deserve the truth. What happened to verifying sources,etc. ? This country, with media help, is going down a Rabbit Hole of "Alternate Facts." That's a Black Hole wherein truth will ultimately disappear. Tragic times and shame on CBS.
I say to CBS if you don't want criticism then get the hell out of the kitchen
When the bad guys complain, you know you're doing the right thing.
This makes me SO DARN ANGRY!!!
As they have for so long and they wonder why their ratings are tanking. Hint: it's not due to streaming. It's content with no character.
Spot on and well said.
I hope it is true their ratings are tanking.
Clarification— *corporate media*
It's disturbing on so many levels that the mainstream media kowtows to the #BLOTUS. TRump is the Biggest Liar of the United States and continually goes unchallenged by the press. It's infuriating.
They own the Press. Same thing happens in England. Time the press was taken out of their hands.
Reposing and earlier comment of mine because I think it's appropriate here:
This is how Trump does it. This is how he gets so many enablers around him. Just give Trump what he wants and then we won't get in trouble. Just give Trump what he wants and then we can use his popularity to win the White House. The only trouble is that Trump, like an addiction, will just keep wanting more and more. There's no end to it. If you can imagine you can ever appease and control this man you're seriously fooling yourself. Guys like Trump don't know the meaning of the word "satisfied". There will never be a time when this pays off, he's gotten what he wants, and now we can go about the business of taking care of our own needs. And the deeper we go in the more painful it is to get out. So better to take the stand NOW.
Hold him accountable like we would any adult. Let him bitch, moan, point fingers and threaten. Unless we want to continue being bullied we have to stand up to the bully.
Right! That's why his niece Mary Trump's book was titled "Too Much and Never Enough."
Yes that’s what he does. And when he doesn’t get his own way on his terms with the media he refuses interviews, walks out & in all cases lies. Regardless the media gets heat for not doing their job. He’s trained them and his minions well. But he’s had 40+ years of practice.
https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4808075-nabj-trump-interview-fact-check-kamala-harris/
There's obviously been a change in policies at CBS, and not for the better. Why should the Republican candidate get a pass? It's spineless and not upholding good journalistic practice.
I wonder if it was a. The only way to get an agreement from trump for a debate.
b. Corporate HQ wanted the ratings.
c. They knew the entire night would be factchecking & he would complain, leave - either way lie about them.
https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4808075-nabj-trump-interview-fact-check-kamala-harris/
Of course!! 😠😡🤬
Spineless at best. Complicit in worst case.
And all treasonous because CBS is giving support and comfort to an INSURRECTIONIST. JD Vance is in support of an INSURRECTIONIST.
Donald Trump is an INSURRECTIONIST
Which is TREASON.
Perfect description, Mr. Powers.
It’s poor journalism for CBS to provide fact-checking to its viewers but not rebut the candidates.. The candidates’ lies need to be confronted by the unbiased source — the moderators.
Absolutely! It's not Tim Walz's job to "police" Vance (who is a tRump clone in terms of character & lying). But I have a feeling Gov. Walz will easily outshine Vance regardless.
Agree 100%. Gutless wonders = CBS
CNN'S Moderators Tapper and Bash were Most Certainly Biased in favor of Trump during the Biden-Trump SHITSHOW/Debate!
They are both worthless faux journalists.
It was such an OBVIOUS bias!! It was embarrassing!! I stopped watching CNN after that night! Not much respect for those two!
Hear hear.
The Press has its 1st Amendment freedom because it is not supposed to be afraid of telling the truth - or presenting information that has been verified and ooh, fact checked. That's not being responsible. That's cowardice.
Yes, we absolutely need moderators to fact check. It's not bias when misinformation is called out. It was really important that ABC called out the "eating cats and dogs" falsehood that Trump dropped and then doubled down on.
I'd also like to add that we need them to ask a question again to both candidates if either candidate dodges a question.
Agree completely, Anne. I stopped watching the TMURP/Harris debate after a half hour because orange man was spewing lies as fast as he could talk, and neither candidate was directly answering any of the questions. Frustrating.
You can tell CBS how angry/disgusted/appalled/outraged or whatever you are about the refusal to fact check. Here's the link: https://www.cbs.com/showfeedback/success/
Is it fear of MAGA blowback or fear of CBS investors losing their tax cut Trump promises? Cowardice and greed do not make for a credible news network. Dan Rather is right, unfortunately.
Done! I chose CBS News Special for the category. Cowardly that they didn't list the debate as a choice. I miss the days when the news had strict lines for being non-biased and professional. I remember being taught about yellow journalism in high school. It seems like that is all we have now.
I did it as CBS News specials...
That's the page on which I wrote my comment to CBS this afternoon (which I shared here a moment ago), even though there was no choice for Debate or for Special Events.
I selected Specials/CBS News Specials.
I did the same and expressed my concerns about not fact, checking immediately
I did CBS News specials
Done!
Done! Thank you, Laurie, and you, Mim, for this link.
I wrote my feelings to CBS .....and also shared this link with others I knew would do so as well. Thanks Laurie for posting the link!!!! The selections I chose were 'Primetime' and 'CBS News Special'
Thanks for posting the comment link to CBS. Very helpful. I contacted them.
Thank you. Have submitted a comment.
Thanks for posting this.
I just used this link successfully. Thx for including the link.
Done, thank you. I hope it went through as it kept saying that I needed to write alphanumeric feedback.
I did. Thank you for providing the information to do so.
I just wrote a fairly long comment, but I’m not sure that it went through. It kept saying when I hit “submit” that I needed to write alphanumeric feedback — which of course I was. Then, I accidentally hit something and lost that screen. When I got back to the screen, my message had disappeared, but I did get a message a moment later on that screen saying “Thank you for your feedback. We will make sure that it gets to the right department” or something along those lines.
The link is not working. Gutless wonders probably disabled it.
Well Dan you are correct CBS is abdicating responsibility
Hate when lies are allowed to go forth its insanity
I wrote this to CBS News on their website this afternoon:
"I am disgusted that a company with your illustrious history of newscasting has decided not to fact check the Walz/Vance debate, knowing without a doubt (because Vance himself admits it) that Vance is a liar. You will do a huge disservice to the viewers by not confronting and refuting the lies and pretending this election is a horse race when it will decide whether we remain a democracy or fall into an autocracy led by a mentally ill, aging man whose running mate is as vicious as he is. You should confront Vance with the horrific implications of Project 2025. You should honor the legacy of Walter Cronkite, Dan Rather and other of your renowned journalists of the past and reconsider your decision to not fact check.
I chose Face the Nation because there was no option for the debate. I hope whoever reads this passes my comment on to the responsible parties."
Mim .....I chose 'Primetime' and then 'CBS News Special'
I didn’t see those options.
Mr. Rather, when I read the non fact checking press release from CBS, I immediately thought of you.
Not challenging any candidates statement, when the questioner knows the answer is a lie. To me, is journalistic malpractice. It’s cowardice.
What a BBC interview or one from Australia. Those people are TOUGH. They don’t normalize LYING, they challenge it.
Shame on CBS for being weak.
As always, you’re spot on!!
How CBS is letting the country down- is beyond me!
Sad state of being!!
The only blow back ABC received was from Trump. I'm proud that they took control of the narrative and called a lie a lie. It's all about the bottom line and ratings. Thank you for keeping us steady.
Very disheartening that CBS made such a poor decision. We can only hope that they get blowback for poor journalism.
If you're not going to fact-check basic lies, you might as well just have Ryan Seacrest or someone moderate the debate.
LOL Nora O’Donnell is no bonus and has always struck me as having a conservative bias.
Have chat got conduct the debate.
You don't need a fact-checker. Here are the answers to the lies most likely to be provided - let's get them out of the way first.
1. Nobody is rounding up pets in Springfield, Ohio to eat them.
2. The Haitian immigrants supposedly doing this are NOT here illegally.
3. Nobody has given illegal immigrants the right to vote, and nobody is proposing such.
4. The very vast majority of crimes committed in the US are committed by legal citizens. Mexico is still not sending murderers, rapists and thieves.
6. The economy is not worse under President Biden than it was during Trump's term.
7. We are all better off than we were 5 years ago.
8. Trump has never had a crowd as large as he continually claims.
Thanks. Well done. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I immediately thought of Dan Rather when I saw the update yesterday about CBS "declining" (refusing?) to fact check the debate in real time and on-air. I'm so glad to see this column! 💪